Zipang vs Mugen

shady · #1 (**permalink**) 01-14-2008, 12:32 AM

Will Zipang be better than Mugen ? I'm not sure whether to wait for Zipang now. Any internal testing done by Scythe to compare the two giant coolers?

Shinigami · #2 (**permalink**) 01-21-2008, 10:30 AM

Hi,

Mugen is performing better than Zipang. So if you want more performance and don't need TOP-Flow cooling, then you can go for Mugen.

We have internal testing, but I would ideally not post it here. I can tell you some of the figures if you like.

bgavin · #3 (**permalink**) 05-04-2008, 04:28 AM

Scythe engineering should also include temperature measurements of the VRM components as part of the product testing.

Q: with the Mugen, does the VRM run considerably hotter?

I own two Zipang, and the standard fan does not properly cool the VRM. Compared against an Intel stock cooler, the Zipang standard fan raises Zone1, Zone2 temps +10C higher than the Intel.

I replaced it with a 120x38 Panaflo 12U at 2750 rpm. This fan keeps the VRM and NB completely cool. Some boards have VRM components on both West (i/o shield) and North sides of the cpu socket. I do not know if Mugen cools East effectively, or if it cools North at all.

Shinigami · #4 (**permalink**) 05-05-2008, 02:03 PM

Hi,

You can check out many sites, there are various tests on it. About the tests, it depends on the Mobo, the Chipset and the cooling. Most Boards connect the hot VRMs with the Chipset, which makes things even worse. 120mm fan with almost 3k RPM is nothing that I ever would call silent.

What is the aim of Zipang? It should cool the CPU more silent. If you need more airflow, a different fan can be used, but we try to supply the best possible solution which is a mix of performance and silence. With 3k RPM fan you sure will have a lot of airflow this way, and this might be the best solution for you =)

VRMs can be cooled more efficient with a good and optimized airflow. I hope this answers the question ^^

bgavin · #5 (**permalink**) 05-05-2008, 05:40 PM

The Zipang stock fan does an excellent job of cooling the CPU. It fails to properly cool the VRM. The fan is simply under powered for this task.

I do not have a variety of 140mm fans at my disposal, so I use what I have for testing. The 120mm Panaflo 12U is at the opposite extreme from the Zipang fan. It keeps both CPU and VRM cooler than the reference Intel cooler. As you note, the 2750 rpm fan noise is outside the Zipang design intent.

There is a lot of middle ground between 900 and 2750 rpm. According to my vendor, Evercool is preparing to enter this market in June with their EC-14025x12E series of 140mm fans with fluid bearings. The RPM range is 600 to 1800 by various model. All of these fans will fit the Zipang, and one of them will keep the VRM cool without requiring a lot of noise.

Scythe has a market-leading product in Zipang, except for the fan. With a proper fan, Zipang would be a serious contender to the Thermalright Ultra 120 that is the benchmark for extreme cooling. Zipang has the added benefit of down-draft VRM cooling that the verticals do not have.

IMO, there is coming a big market for 140mm fans with fluid bearings. The larger fans moves more air with less noise, and the fluid bearings last much longer than cheap sleeve bearings. This is important because Zipang mounts the fan in the horizontal position, which I understand is early end-of-life for sleeve bearing fans. Scythe can lead the way with 140mm fans, or get left behind.

Shinigami · #6 (**permalink**) 05-06-2008, 12:33 PM

Thanks for the feedback. I would say we continue in the following thread to don't discuss things twice :P

http://www.scythe-eu.com/forum/zipan...ipang-fan.html

bgavin · #7 (**permalink**) 05-06-2008, 06:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shinigami

I would say we continue in the following thread to don't discuss things twice

Good idea. My point in this thread is for the OP to consider VRM cooling. That is one primary difference between Mugen and Zipang.

The thread noted by Shinigami is about Zipang and optimal fan choice. It is not a Mugen vs. Zipang thread.

shady · #8 (**permalink**) 04-30-2009, 04:10 AM

Zipang 2 has been released. How does it perform compared to Zipang 1? Is it better than Mugen and Mugen 2? Im considering these few coolers for my Core i7 setup. Thanks!

hiroshige · #9 (**permalink**) 04-30-2009, 08:00 AM

Hello shady,

Zipang has been released for Asia only at the moment, therefore we do not have any comparisons available for now.

Please do not forget that Zipang 2 and Mugen 2 have two completely different cooling prinicples which makes a direct comparison nearly impossible.

Kind regards,
Stefan - Scythe EU Hamburg

Kind regards,
Stefan

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#1 (permalink) 01-14-2008, 12:32 AM
shady Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 3	Zipang vs Mugen Will Zipang be better than Mugen ? I'm not sure whether to wait for Zipang now. Any internal testing done by Scythe to compare the two giant coolers?

#2 (permalink) 01-21-2008, 10:30 AM
Shinigami Product Manager Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Hamburg Posts: 960	Hi, Mugen is performing better than Zipang. So if you want more performance and don't need TOP-Flow cooling, then you can go for Mugen. We have internal testing, but I would ideally not post it here. I can tell you some of the figures if you like. __________________ * Register and enjoy the official Scythe Forum * Compatibility List for Scythe CPU Coolers

#3 (permalink) 05-04-2008, 04:28 AM
bgavin Junior Member Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 17	Scythe engineering should also include temperature measurements of the VRM components as part of the product testing. Q: with the Mugen, does the VRM run considerably hotter? I own two Zipang, and the standard fan does not properly cool the VRM. Compared against an Intel stock cooler, the Zipang standard fan raises Zone1, Zone2 temps +10C higher than the Intel. I replaced it with a 120x38 Panaflo 12U at 2750 rpm. This fan keeps the VRM and NB completely cool. Some boards have VRM components on both West (i/o shield) and North sides of the cpu socket. I do not know if Mugen cools East effectively, or if it cools North at all.
	Last edited by bgavin; 05-04-2008 at 04:34 AM.. Reason: edited for clarity

#4 (permalink) 05-05-2008, 02:03 PM
Shinigami Product Manager Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Hamburg Posts: 960	Hi, You can check out many sites, there are various tests on it. About the tests, it depends on the Mobo, the Chipset and the cooling. Most Boards connect the hot VRMs with the Chipset, which makes things even worse. 120mm fan with almost 3k RPM is nothing that I ever would call silent. What is the aim of Zipang? It should cool the CPU more silent. If you need more airflow, a different fan can be used, but we try to supply the best possible solution which is a mix of performance and silence. With 3k RPM fan you sure will have a lot of airflow this way, and this might be the best solution for you =) VRMs can be cooled more efficient with a good and optimized airflow. I hope this answers the question ^^ __________________ * Register and enjoy the official Scythe Forum * Compatibility List for Scythe CPU Coolers

#5 (permalink) 05-05-2008, 05:40 PM
bgavin Junior Member Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 17	The Zipang stock fan does an excellent job of cooling the CPU. It fails to properly cool the VRM. The fan is simply under powered for this task. I do not have a variety of 140mm fans at my disposal, so I use what I have for testing. The 120mm Panaflo 12U is at the opposite extreme from the Zipang fan. It keeps both CPU and VRM cooler than the reference Intel cooler. As you note, the 2750 rpm fan noise is outside the Zipang design intent. There is a lot of middle ground between 900 and 2750 rpm. According to my vendor, Evercool is preparing to enter this market in June with their EC-14025x12E series of 140mm fans with fluid bearings. The RPM range is 600 to 1800 by various model. All of these fans will fit the Zipang, and one of them will keep the VRM cool without requiring a lot of noise. Scythe has a market-leading product in Zipang, except for the fan. With a proper fan, Zipang would be a serious contender to the Thermalright Ultra 120 that is the benchmark for extreme cooling. Zipang has the added benefit of down-draft VRM cooling that the verticals do not have. IMO, there is coming a big market for 140mm fans with fluid bearings. The larger fans moves more air with less noise, and the fluid bearings last much longer than cheap sleeve bearings. This is important because Zipang mounts the fan in the horizontal position, which I understand is early end-of-life for sleeve bearing fans. Scythe can lead the way with 140mm fans, or get left behind.
	Last edited by bgavin; 05-05-2008 at 05:42 PM.. Reason: edited for clarity

#6 (permalink) 05-06-2008, 12:33 PM
Shinigami Product Manager Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Hamburg Posts: 960	Thanks for the feedback. I would say we continue in the following thread to don't discuss things twice :P http://www.scythe-eu.com/forum/zipan...ipang-fan.html __________________ * Register and enjoy the official Scythe Forum * Compatibility List for Scythe CPU Coolers

#8 (permalink) 04-30-2009, 04:10 AM
shady Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 3	Zipang 2 has been released. How does it perform compared to Zipang 1? Is it better than Mugen and Mugen 2? Im considering these few coolers for my Core i7 setup. Thanks!

#9 (permalink) 04-30-2009, 08:00 AM
hiroshige Marketing/Service Coordinator Join Date: May 2008 Location: Hamburg Posts: 988	Hello shady, Zipang has been released for Asia only at the moment, therefore we do not have any comparisons available for now. Please do not forget that Zipang 2 and Mugen 2 have two completely different cooling prinicples which makes a direct comparison nearly impossible. Kind regards, Stefan - Scythe EU Hamburg Kind regards, Stefan __________________ Scythe EU GmbH Support Hamburg Register and enjoy the official Scythe Forum Compatibility List for Scythe CPU Coolers We do not accept unpaid packages! Wir akzeptieren keine unfreien Zusendungen!